Showing posts with label Marine Q&A. Show all posts
Showing posts with label Marine Q&A. Show all posts

Tuesday, 17 November 2015

Gelcoat Damage- Below the waterline

 

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GELCOAT DAMAGE BELOW THE WATER LINE.  How serious is this?

 When you pull your boat at the end of the season it is not uncommon to find chips, scratches and gouges below the water line. The question is do the repairs really require immediate attention, the short answer is yes but not right away. I will explain!

First lets cover why you would wait to complete the repair this time of year. When you hauled your boat out, the hull was and still is wet. Every hull has a moisture content or the amount of moisture the lamination has managed to pick up. Each hull will have picked up a percentage of moisture content over the years. In the case of a new boat the humidity may have been very high the day that they laid the fiberglass material in your boat, thus creating trapped moisture there from day one. Not to worry any thing below 6% is considered very dry. There is a tool to measure this level of moisture, (moisture meter). Surveyors love them, but half the time they are not calibrated right or the operator doesn't know how to read it correctly.(Moisture meters are a whole other topic we will get into later). In the winter weather conditions are dry after the freeze, dry cold air, this air will help dry out the damaged areas in preparation for your repair(s). Drying the hull will make for a higher quality repair! The dryer the repair area the more likely it is that the bond of the repair will be better and the gel coat patch will not become contaminated. So take advantage of the cold dry winter weather, let it dry out the damaged area.


So what's the big deal a couple of chips cant be that bad? There are two common trains of thought.
 1- Fiber glass cannot rot
 2- Fiber glass is water proof.
 Both of these statements are incorrect. Fiberglass material can rot. This happens when the material gets so damp that mold and mildew starts to break down the mechanical bonds between the layers of material used to build up the thickness of your hull or deck. You can actually pull the black rotten fiber glass layers apart like a layer cake. Water will also break down the resin which surrounds the  fiberglass strings in the material.( There is a tell tale sign that this is happening. The water in the material starts to smell like vinegar when you break through to these areas). This is called wicking, the water will break the resin down and actually flow up hill from the water line toward the deck and hull joint.

 The second misinformation is that gel coat is water proof, it is not! As soon as you breach the resin rich surface, the gel coat can be penetrated by water and this causes damage such as blisters and high moisture content developing and spreading through the hull. (A foot note: When you sand the bottom of a boat in preparation for antifoul you are breaching the resin rich surface. There are several great sand less primers on the market, use these product instead of sanding. You will need to use the same brand of primer and paint. I have done over a hundred bottom paint jobs this way in the Pacific North West and it will work great provided all instructions are followed). Maintaining a resin rich and unbroken gel coat layer below the water line is very important to the life of your boat.

Back to the question, Yes these repairs below the water line are important to complete for the above mentioned reasons. Any repair work below the water line should be your priority, just remember that the outside of the hull is not the only area to the hull which can be chipped or damage. Boat owners often over look the inside of the hull in the bilges, damage in these areas have the same effect on the hull as exterior damage as the bilge usually always has water laying around in it. The hull will draw moisture from the inside or out. Damaged gel coat (referred to as base coat on the interior of the hull) can also lead to rot of structural components and water contaminating the floatation foam areas.

Where do these little chips and gouges come from? Well there is an answer for this. Most of the damage will come from haul out and launch. If you are using a trailer then you know how easy it can be to make an error in judgment and get on the trailer wrong and hit the trailer. If you are using a travel lift then little rubs and damage can occur. Areas that are exposed in most cases are the factory voids. These are areas where they did not roll out the material behind the gel coat very well and these areas have opened up. We refer to these areas as air voids, this type of damage is very common on edges of lifting strakes and hull steps where there are tight 90 degree edges that the material must try to lay in. Of course you may have ran over some debris that was just below the surface or hit the hull with fishing equipment such as down rigger weights. The most common damage to the hull, bar none is beaching damage. The boat owner will run the bow up onto the sand. Causing the gel coat on the keel to be sanded away leaving and exposed area of material along the very bottom of the boat, this area could be several feet long and several inches wide (if this is common practice for you consider a keel guard purchase or have an extra couple of layers of gel applied in this area).


While we are on the topic of hull damage and the importance of  keeping the area below the water line in good repair, lets briefly touch on epoxy barrier coating. One of my pet peeves, an oversold expensive product that does work, yet is applied more times than not, for no reason at all. Barrier coats are designed to prevent moisture penetration, this makes sense for new boats that have not been in the water for years. Dry hulls definitely benefit from a barrier coat system. However keep in mind if it won't let water in, then it only makes sense that it won't let water out. So if you apply it to an older boat not only are you are trapping the moisture content in the hull, but you are eliminating the possibility of air drying over the off season. You can dry the fiberglass material out before you install the barrier. This will require stripping all of the gel coat from the waterline down (a massive undertaking), having a controlled environment and several days with heater pods to dry the material. ( Just ask Black Line in Sydney BC they are the very best at blister repairs). So it may make you feel better. But are you not throwing your money away by barrier coating an old hull? Just think about it! If you currently have a barrier coat then it is important to remember it too must be repaired if you have gel coat damage.

To guarantee access to all of  Boat Nut Magazine articles, pictures and featured services visit the official Boat Nut Magazine ©™ website. Be sure to reply to the Boat Nut Association registration on our site for the latest Boat Nut weekly and monthly news letters and opportunities.


  
Copyright 2015 © Boat Nut Media, Toronto, Ontario. All rights reserved. No part of this information/publications may be stored in a retrieval system, transmitted, or reproduced in any way, including but not limited to photocopy, magnetic, or other record, without prior agreement and written permission of the publisher, Boat Nuts Media ©™ No liability is assumed with respect to the information provided.  

Saturday, 14 November 2015

CAPTAIN O' CAPTAIN


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                    CAPTAIN O CAPTAIN , HOW DO I KNOW ITS TRUE?

First let me ask why are all the boat experts referred to as captain? Is calling yourself a captain a self appointed arrogant way of saying I know boats, or is it to give you a warm and fuzzy feeling that they are telling you the facts. After all they must know something he/she is a captain. I personally hate being referred to as a captain, I spent over 40 years around boats, and always thought of a captain as someone who was responsible for the safe operation of a vessel. Someone who is an expert at charts and navigation. A captain would be the go to person for maritime laws and rules not necessarily the person to keep the vessel in tip top order, there is a crew for that. So I consider myself crew and not a captain.


SO WHAT MAKES ME SO SMART?

My phone rings everyday with questions about all matter of topics to do with maintenance, repair and opinions of all years makes and models of power boats. This is what I have discover opinions are like ass holes everyone has one! Most of the opinions are founded on self gain and sales, you call a company or expert and they are trying to figure out how to cash in. You are a potential cash cow, do they want to advise you or raid your wallet.............

I started this blog to provide the best information I could with the thought that over 30 years of international power boat repairs, operation and maintenance would be of value to you the boat owner. As there is little quality information and entertainment to do with power boating maybe I could grow this idea into something fun and truth full, not a every boat and boat product is the greatest thing you have ever seen. There are enough of those sites out there
.

So what makes me any different than any other so called expert? I feel I should explain my back ground and how I earned a degree from the Boat Nut University. I received my PHD in power boat repair from putting in Plenty of Hard Days. Making mistakes, learning and listening to the best  people the industry had and has to offer, these are not the advise givers they are the people who build and service boats around the world. Person's that boat builders rely on to fly to some little country where there are no supply stores and fix every issue big or small on any boat at a moments notice. We needed to be experts at every system of any size boat any model year. No fancy titles just able to do anything trouble shooters, providing a written account of why the part or system failed in the field, design a repair procedure for others to follow, and supply engineering with solutions to stop the failure on future models of the same or similar boats.  There where not many of us.

You had to be able to disassemble an entire boat in the field, as well as be a mechanic, upholstery, wood worker, electrician, plumber, fiberglass expert you name it. Back in the 80s and 90s we received certificates for each trade we mastered even receiving US Coast Guard certificates for fuel systems. But that's all gone now, new technicians are parts swappers, the best you can get is a service school diploma.

My client base included plenty of names you will recognize:

  • Sea Ray
  • Bayliner
  • Robalo
  • Wahoo
  • Boston Whaler
  • Trophy
  • Meridian
  • Maxum
  • Baja
  • Tiara
  • Ranger
  • Wellcraft
  • Prowler
  • Rinker
  • Hydra Sport
  • Astro/ Procraft
  • Campion
  • Thundercraft
  • Chris Craft
  • Trojan
  • Glasstron
  • Four Winns
  • Larson
  • Mastercraft
  • Lund
  • World Cat
  • Polar
  • Fountain
  • Cigerette
  • Doral
  • and many more custom and private boats
This variety of manufacturers and model years have provided a unique insight into power boats and how they have evolved over the last 35 plus years. I have repaired and operated all of the above boats, in all types of environments. These experiences coupled with the amazingly skilled people that I have had the pleasure of having as colleges and friends have prepared me to sit down and write honest, informative and entertaining information for you the boat owners.



Any feed back or opinions are welcome at boatnutmedia@gmail.com!!!!

To guarantee access to all of  Boat Nut Magazine articles, pictures and featured services visit the official Boat Nut Magazine ©™ website. Be sure to reply to the Boat Nut Association registration on our site for the latest Boat Nut weekly and monthly news letters and opportunities.




Copyright 2015 © Boat Nut Media, Toronto, Ontario. All rights reserved. No part of this information/publications may be stored in a retrieval system, transmitted, or reproduced in any way, including but not limited to photocopy, magnetic, or other record, without prior agreement and written permission of the publisher, Boat Nuts Media ©™ No liability is assumed with respect to the information provided.           

Monday, 23 March 2015

Telemarinetech part 2 BNTN Program


                                                         

http://boatnutmagazine.com/



Telemarinetech the best tool you will have as a boater, we field all questions you may have!

Please Email boatnutmedia@gmail.com to receive more information and an application

You can read over the information and look at the application before you commit to the program, There is no limit to the amount of times you use the service. Any question any time BNTN is the perfect addition to your boat ownership plan. Boat Nut Media guarantees your satisfaction or you will get a full refund. The specialists that will help you are hand selected marine technicians who can explain your answers in an easy to understand language.

You now have an expert available to you 7 days a week, Our specialists believe that any question is a good question we want you to be informed about your boat, because when a problem comes up you are usually on your own. It is rare that you have a problem with an expert on board with you. The idea for this program stems from the days when I was in the boat service business, My clients were able to call me anytime, my phone used to ring over 21 times before noon almost every day from boaters who had questions ranging from mechanical failures to what size anchor do I need. With break down questions we could get the boat running 99 percent of the time over the phone and save the boating day or trip! Telemarinetech is not trying to take the place of your marine mechanic ,we are designed to be a support program for you.

This program is ideal for  New Boaters who are just starting to boat, Boaters who cruise distances, and Experienced Boaters who just need to make inquires to verify that what they are dealing with is accurate. We can take the time with you that a service technician cannot always give you



Telemarinetech/ BNTN details at boatnutmedia@gmail.com
on our blog, and on twitter @BoatNutMedia

To guarantee access to all of  Boat Nut Magazine articles, pictures and featured services visit the official Boat Nut Magazine ©™ website. Be sure to reply to the Boat Nut Association registration on our site for the latest Boat Nut weekly and monthly news letters and opportunities.



Copyright 2015 © Boat Nut Media, Toronto, Ontario. All rights reserved. No part of this information/publications may be stored in a retrieval system, transmitted, or reproduced in any way, including but not limited to photocopy, magnetic, or other record, without prior agreement and written permission of the publisher, Boat Nuts Media ©™ No liability is assumed with respect to the information provided.

Sunday, 22 March 2015

Gas or Diesel? A Follow Up.


More detailed information on the boats in response to a readers questions 



 Diesel boat details are as follows:
1- Twin Cummins Diamond  Series Inboard 8400 with diesel generator
2-  Vessel weight 28495 lbs
3- 799 hrs
Boat had 1/2 Tank of fuel when departing, and was empty of all but safety gear, no water and pumped out.

Gas boat details
1-Twin 8.1  Crusader motors with gas generator
2-Vessel weight 27495 lbs
3- 65 hours

Boat had 1/2 tank of fuel when departing and was empty of all but safety gear, no water and pumped out

Both boats where side by side when they left and arrived the same way, this was a rare occasion where the two boats where ran side by side all the way. The gas boat set the pace at 4500 RPM.and the diesel matched the pace. The price per gallon of fuel was not critical to the discussion, as we were not trying to determine gallons per hour of fuel burn. It was a general note that the a diesels cruising range based on the same amount of fuel far exceeds gas, as the diesel burnt just about half of the gas boat period. These two boats are rigged with identical size single center mounted fuel tanks.

Water line difference question:

One of the questions was in regard to water line at the dock with no one on board it is obvious that there is a difference as the diesel boat weight is 1000 lbs more than the gas boat.

Does the diesel motor work as hard as the gas motor:

No diesel motors do not the gas motor develops a huge amount of torque when pulling through the RPM range yes, but does not maintain the torque  and hp at the prop any were near were a diesel motor does. Diesels love to be under a constant load.  All boats have hull speed limitations that are available, if you are hitting the max RPM well before the recognized hull speed then you may have the wrong prop package on the boat. That is not the case in this comparison.

What Does it mean when you say diesels are not affected by boat load as gas motors do:

This is in reference to the fact that many times on a boat this size you will add a tender on a bracket of one type or another and the fact is the diesel will not hardly be affected. A gas motor will feel the load difference. Every boat in Canada has a load capacity plate do you know where it is on your boat, if you ignore this plate load limit it will affect any boat with any power plant not just due to motor lag but the hull design can be affected which is a safety issue, so Know your load limit and stay within it. One of the ways to know the true boat weight is at the travel lift most boat owners do not ask the weight of the boat when hauled out.


These boats were brought up to RPM and left there for four hours, and the diesel did need a service, Had it have had the service the smoke may have been reduced however it would have burned cleaner and got better fuel burn. Not all diesels are smokey and smelly as many have under water exhaust this is why I stated that the exhaust set up on this particular boat is poor, but if you think that a diesel has no odor at an idle at the dock you are wrong. Out on the lake or in the open the exhaust can escape away, but against a dock in that trapped space they smell. You know when a diesel starts and is idling if it is backed into the dock which is the way 99 percent of the boats that I attend are moored.


This was a comparison done of two identical boats from the same manufacturer out of the same factory, all original no modifications, Boat Nut Media could get out of control with prop sizes and pitches and wet load weight, but that is not our goal. We try to provide information that is based on facts the way we see the boats and the way they run. This is the way the manufacturer delivered them and that is what boaters really have to deal with.

You can always break a boats running information down into a significant amount of detail, but at the end of the day the boat will do what it is going to do, and I tell it as I see it not every one will like it or agree with it.




Original response from one of our readers:

I only know what I have seen in diesel boats and what I have been involved with on discussion boards such as this.
This is one of the most common ways leading to people ruining their diesels.....
"The last benefit to a diesel is they do not seem to care what you load on your boat they seem to perform pretty much the same way with or without the tender and all your gear on board"
they load the boat heavily over time and overload the diesel engines.
And this way as well....
"This makes for a much smoother ride in the diesel as the running gear is larger you just do not feel like you are pushing the diesel hard at all."
They feel like the diesel are not working hard so they run them to fats and way to near their max rpm's when over propped.
"Both boats were ran side by side down the lake for four hours on plain. The gas boat burnt $400.00 worth of fuel and the diesel burned approximately half of that $220.00."
This tells us nothing about fuel burn rates as fuel prices are different in various places. around here the price of gas is typically 10-15% more than diesel fuel at marina docks. The 41 Silverton we cruise with typically gets about 0.5 nmpg at its cruise of 15-16 knots burning over 30 gph at those speeds.
"So the weight difference is mainly in the motors themselves. However we will say the gas boat sits approximately two inches higher than the diesel boat at the water line."
There is no way to know which diesels are in this boat but we know they do weigh more - even if they weigh a combined 1,000#'s more than the big block gas engines there is something really wrong with a 2" difference in hull height. As a comparison I can take on 400 Gallons of fuel and 200 gallons of water and that only affects my height be about 1" (about 4,500#'s). What 41" boat goes down 2" at the water line when 6 adults or so have boarded?
" At an idle at the dock the diesel can be dirty and smelly, as a matter of fact other boaters were not happy with long term idling"
We have commonly been on raft-up where more than half a dozen larger diesel gensets were running and there was no noticeable smell.
Similarly when the boats come in to tie up and the mains are running (various brands) there is very little noticeable smell.
I am guessing there are some other issues with each of these boats which may affect comparisons of individual differences. Engine condition, prop sizing, prop and running gear condition and boat loading all can make a very large difference. Running any side by side comparison is hard even wen you know the boats engines are well tuned and each boat is evenly loaded and in good shape.
Hope this helps

Thanks again for the comments they are great. Again I am not an expert but I would ask the following:they load the boat heavily over time and overload the diesel engines. Is this overloading only an issue with diesel owners or is this more of a problem of boater education ?They feel like the diesel are not working hard so they run them to fats and way to near their max rpm's when over propped. Same question as above. Does this really invalidate the comparison or is this more an issue of boater education ?
]
This tells us nothing about fuel burn rates as fuel prices are different in various places. around here the price of gas is typically 10-15% more than diesel fuel at marina docks. The 41 Silverton we cruise with typically gets about 0.5 nmpg at its cruise of 15-16 knots burning over 30 gph at those speeds. Since the claimed fuel consumption is about 50% less to travel at the same speed and distance does it really matter what the cost of the fuel was. What if the test was done when the prices were exactly the same ?There is no way to know which diesels are in this boat but we know they do weigh more - even if they weigh a combined 1,000#'s more than the big block gas engines there is something really wrong with a 2" difference in hull height. As a comparison I can take on 400 Gallons of fuel and 200 gallons of water and that only affects my height be about 1" (about 4,500#'s). What 41" boat goes down 2" at the water line when 6 adults or so have boarded? A good observation and you are right more information would have been good. But the same question. Does this invalidate the comparison ?We have commonly been on raft-up where more than half a dozen larger diesel gensets were running and there was no noticeable smell.
Similarly when the boats come in to tie up and the mains are running (various brands) there is very little noticeable smell.
I am guessing there are some other issues with each of these boats which may affect comparisons of individual differences. Engine condition, prop sizing, prop and running gear condition and boat loading all can make a very large difference. Running any side by side comparison is hard even wen you know the boats engines are well tuned and each boat is evenly loaded and in good shape.
I guess everyone has their own experience's in terms of the smell of diesel boats. But you make a very valid point that if they are not properly cared for the issue can be much worse.

We would like to thank our readers for their comments and questions, as this is exactly what we were hoping for. We wanted other boaters, technicians, and manufacturers to voice their opinions, and share their experiences. After all we are a boating community and should all have a voice in it. We are simply trying to bring the BOAT NUTS together.





To guarantee access to all of  Boat Nut Magazine articles, pictures and featured services visit the official Boat Nut Magazine ©™ website. Be sure to reply to the Boat Nut Association registration on our site for the latest Boat Nut weekly and monthly news letters and opportunities.


Copyright 2015 © Boat Nut Media, Toronto, Ontario. All rights reserved. No part of this information/publications may be stored in a retrieval system, transmitted, or reproduced in any way, including but not limited to photocopy, magnetic, or other record, without prior agreement and written permission of the publisher, Boat Nuts Media ©™ No liability is assumed with respect to the information provided.